What To Do When Sexytime Hurts with Dr. Uchenna “UC” Ossai

JOIN IN THE DISCUSSION ON THIS EPISODE AND MORE IN MY FREE FACEBOOK GROUP, FIND YOUR FEMININE FIRE HERE.

Dr. Uchenna “UC” Ossai is a sex-positive pelvic health physical therapist and sexuality educator and counselor. Dr. UC is assistant professor at the University of Texas Dell Medical School and also serves as pelvic health program manager at UT Health Austin. She is on faculty for the University of Michigan, School of Social Work’s Sexual Health Certification Program. 

Dr. UC is one of few licensed physical therapists in the world with an AASECT certification in sexuality counseling; as well as the only Black physical therapist with this specific designation. Dr. UC spends her days treating people with both sexual and pelvic floor dysfunction, and her evenings educating the masses on everything that has to do with “sexytime”. When it comes to sexual intelligence and great sex education, UC embraces always being unapologetically real, happily crunk, and deliciously kind.

Grab her Ebook: Sexy Swagger, A Guide to Reimagining Your Sex Life Here.

To learn more about UC, Check out her website that has LOADS of gems HERE.

Follow her on insta here.

Check out her fab free sex ed resource platform Woke is the New Sexy HERE.

If you liked this episode, please consider giving me a 5 Star Review on Apple Podcasts! It truly does help the podcast grow. 

EPISODE 209: with UC Ossai

[Fun, Empowering Music]

Amanda Testa: Hello, and welcome to the Find Your Feminine Fire podcast. I am your host, Amanda Testa. I am a sex, love, and relationship coach, and in this podcast, my guests and I talk sex, love, and relationships, and everything that lights you up from the inside out. Welcome!

Hello, everyone, and welcome to the podcast. If you ever struggle with pelvic pain or painful sex or are just looking for ways to have more pleasure, I’m really excited for today’s podcast because I am going to be talking with Dr. Uchenna Ossai who is a sex-positive pelvic health physical therapist as well as a sexuality educator and counselor. She also goes by UC, and Dr. UC, she’s also an assistant professor. She has a very long laundry list of amazing credentials, and not only is she only of the few licensed PTs who also has a certification in sexuality counseling (I just think that’s amazing), as well as the only Black physical therapist with this designation. 

0:01:05

And so, I feel like that’s such a beautiful thing to have this combination. She’s so fun. I love her playful way of sharing about sex and all these topics that can be considered taboo but are so important to talk about, and so, she has an amazing Instagram channel, @youseelogic, and she has such good information there, and she’s so much fun. Every time I see one of your reels or one of your posts, I’m always like, “Yes!” It always brings so much joy to me because you talk about such amazing things in such a fun and playful way, so thank you for all that you do.

UC Ossai: Thank you so much for having me. Thank you. That was such a beautiful intro. I feel like aww, who’s this nice person that you're discussing? It’s me! [Laughs]

Amanda Testa: Yes, it’s you!

UC Ossai: It’s me! No, thank you! I appreciate you saying that, mainly because I love educating the community, the masses, other providers, consumers of care in the way that I do because we were not given -- at least when I was growing up, I wasn't given education about my sexuality, my sensuality, my eroticism, all of that, in this way. 

0:02:16

It wasn't given to me in a particular framework that was easy or felt appropriate to bring up in a healthcare space or with my family and friends, and so, I just wanted to kind of break down that barrier. So, that’s where You See Logic was born. 

Amanda Testa: I love it, and I feel like, too, so many can probably relate to that experience, you know? I think, obviously, the sex education system here in the U.S. is terrible, and just in general, it’s something that we can always learn more, right?

UC Ossai: Always. Always. I think that’s why I focus on sex ed for grown folk, becuase I think we all thought that we stopped our education at 18 across the globe or even sooner than that. Who knows, and as adults, as we’re getting into relationships with people, as we’re having kids or not having kids, whatever your choice is, but evolving as a human, so does our sexuality, and we’re not necessarily given that continuing lifespan base education on sex which we so desperately need.

0:03:26

Amanda Testa: Yes, yes, and I think it is interesting you say people stop learning about it at 18, and it’s true! Then, you see people that might have pelvic pain or don’t really know how to talk about it or are in relationships where it’s very unfulfilling in that department or where they don't really understand how much potential for pleasure is in their bodies. I know that was me too. [Laughs]

UC Ossai: Absolutely.

Amanda Testa: It’s a learnable skill!

UC Ossai: Right? It is! It is.

Amanda Testa: You know, there was something that I saw on your website that really struck me. I mean, I know there’s a lot of people that report pelvic pain, but there was a quote that I saw: “Eighty percent of women who have chronic pelvic pain are still having penetrative sex despite reporting moderate to severe pain.”

0:04:13

UC Ossai: Yes.

Amanda Testa: That just made me so sad.

UC Ossai: Yes. Yes, yes, yes. As a pelvic health physical therapist, I see this every single day where the burden of being -- not burden, but I think that what society puts on women and vulva owners is -- they put a lot on us to perform, to provide, right? I think that, no matter your sexuality, no matter your relationship structure, it gets internalized. You can be the wokest, dopest progressive person out there, but you still have internalized this societal messaging because it’s hardwired in all of us. We’re all swimming in the same pool, and it does take a lot of conscious work to get ourselves out of that mindset, but then when you're having sexual pain, often times people say, “Oh, it’s just easier for me to grin and bear it than tell my partner it hurts because I don't want them to lose access to this part of being sexual.” 

0:05:21

Also, it speaks to the notion that we define sex as only penetrative sex, right? That that’s the gold standard of sex, and it’s really not. It’s a beautiful, fun way to access our sexual pleasure, but it’s not the only way to access our sexual pleasure, and I know some people roll their eyes, and they're like, “Yeah, I get it, but…” and that’s really because of how that individual is looking at sex, right? If your viewpoint of sex is, “Well, foreplay, penetration, thats it,” then yeah, that’s going to be how we are going to move in space. That’s how you’re gonna negotiate your sexual pain in that framework, but if you have a more expansive view on sex, and saying, “Yes, penetration is an important part of my sex life, but there are also other things I can do while I figure out how to manage my pain with the penetrative model. 

0:06:21

That’s where I want a lot of my patients and community members to get to. I’m not saying throw out the concept or notion of having penetrative sex. I’m not saying it’s not good or bad or whatever. I’m saying it’s a component of being sexual, not the component of being sexual.

Amanda Testa: That’s such an important point to note, because I think if people are experiencing pelvic pain, and instead of having to feel uncomfortable or feel like, “Well, this is the only way that I know,” or, “This is my partner’s go-to,” it doesn't mean you have to totally cut off yourself from intimate connection. It can just look different, right? I think that’s sometimes very hard for people to wrap their heads around. 

UC Ossai: Absolutely, and we tend to -- it’s gonna hit different depending on if you're in a heterosexual relationship or a homosexual relatonship or you're pansexual --

Amanda Testa: Yeah.

0:07:23

UC Ossai: -- depending on how you rest or explore, and so, it’s gonna play out differently ‘cause you might, depending on how your relationship structure is and how you engage in sex with your partner, that does play a significant role. If there’s a more traditional approach that you take -- traditional is not necessarily saying conservative or anything like that. Some people, traditional for them is open discussion of sex. For some people, traditional is, if they're in a heterosexual relationship, having the man lead in terms of the sexual encounter and the woman follows.

Amanda Testa: Yeah.

UC Ossai: So, you know, that’s where we’re talking about a cultural approach. A cultural approach isn't necessarily racial. It’s about how does one engage in life, period --

Amanda Testa: Yes.

UC Ossai: -- and how those power dynamics play out in the sexual aspects of their relationships, whether those are long term relationships or short term relationships. 

Amanda Testa: Yeah, I’m wondering, too, with that, communication is such a big key.

UC Ossai: Huge.

Amanda Testa: And I feel like, in some ways, people are good at it and in some ways they're not, and also, I feel like sometimes the more progressive or the more you are comfortable talking about your sexuality, the more you are comfortable in your own body, the easier it is to talk about your boundaries or what is good or what you want or having those discussions before any kind of connection. 

0:08:45

Then, also, sometimes too, if you're in whatever kind of relationship and it’s been more of a long term thing, it’s easy to just get into patterns where maybe you don't talk about it. And so, I’m wondering, maybe, if you have any tips around talking about your sexual needs and how to bring up those conversations because I hear that all the time from clients. That’s one of the hardest things. They can talk about everything but not this one thing. It feels really hard to talk about.

UC Ossai: Absolutely. Absolutely. So I love this question, and I think that you can do it many ways, but the first thing that we have to think about when we’re wanting to bring this up is we have to start with ourselves, and we have to ask ourselves this question: how have I defined my sexuality? Is it solely through the eyes of my partner or is it through my own eyes? Based on that -- right, if you're saying okay, I’m doing this through my own eyes, what is it that you’re looking for? What is it that you need? Is it that you need novelty? Is it that you need more intimacy, more connection? 

0:09:47

Is it that you need more aggressive touch? Is it that you need lighter touch? Really think about what it is that you're looking for. Is it that you need more words of verbal affirmation during sex or do you need less verbal affirmation and more just your partner paying attention to you and understanding what the physical cues are? Have you had that discussion with your partner? Then, once you figure that out, it’s a lot easier to talk to your partner about what your needs are, especially if you’ve been in a long term relationship.

0:10:27

I just did a post yesterday, actually, about looking at your partner with fresh eyes, with new perspective, especially long term partners, right? You're looking at them, and you're like yeah, I know their moves, I know this, but have you ever just taken a moment to stop and close your eyes for a second and open your eyes and look at them and observe them as if it was the first time you met them, as if you do not know that they're ticklish behind their left ear, as if you do not know that they don't like their stomach being exposed? How about that, right? 

0:11:00

Maybe that can be a simple exercise because depending on how your partner is, they may respond to some type of, “Hey, babe, I would like to try this game out,” versus talking directly. Some people love direct communication, and some people don't, right? Some people may say, “Oh, I don't feel comfortable with this,” or maybe you can just tell your partner, “You know what, I would just like to try something where I’m in charge, and I’m gonna blindfold you, and I’m gonna  massage you,” and you can do the things you want to do with them, and then you guys can debrief, and that can be a way to open up that conversation.

Everyone has a different style, you just have to first, like I said, figure out what it is that you need and are looking for or want to explore, and then think about how that communication will be best received with your partner and also how it would be best received with you because sex is a collaboration, and the reality is, I think the fear that a lot of people have when they say how do I talk to my partner, it’s not that they arent ready, it’s that they may be fearful that their partner isn’t ready, their partner isn't examining the way that they're examining, and they don't want their partner to feel bad because their partner may have a different understanding of sexuality than they do. 

0:12:19

That’s where the problem is, to be honest, because I think if people were on the same page with each other, it’d be a lot easier to talk about it, but since you're not, it’s like, “Oh, I don't know how to talk to my boo who’s a little sensitive when it comes to talking about sex.”

Amanda Testa: Yeah. 

UC Ossai: And so, I tell people that there’s nothing wrong with trying out some of these techniques, but then if it’s not landing, there’s nothing wrong with getting help from an amazing coach like yourself, from a licensed mental health provider, from a sex counselor, from whoever you feel comfortable communicating with. That is actually an amazing opportunity to reimagine your sex life, to construct a new dialogue and expand, right? I tell people every time you have a roadblock and there’s a willingness from the both of you, and it doesn't even have to be an equal level or intensity of willingness, but just at least some, it’s a beautiful opportunity to grow.

0:13:18

Amanda Testa: Yes, I love that willingness and just having that fresh look. 

UC Ossai: Yeah!

Amanda Testa: Even just as you say it my body’s like oh, that opens up a little bit because there is such possibility in that, right? 

UC Ossai: There’s so much possibility. Like I said, pretend that you're the freshman. Don't be the professor. You're not the expert. Stop.

Amanda Testa: Yes!

UC Ossai: It’s also a lot of work to be the expert. Think about that. It’s a lot of work to be the expert. If you guys wanna do a mindful thing right now just think about it. Be like I am the expert, and I’m always having to tell boo thang about what I -- ugh, can’t I just be an observer? Can I just be a learner? Can I just take on the role of being the explorer and discover again? You can do that anytime you want. 

Amanda Testa: I love that. The explorer versus the expert.

UC Ossai: Be that sexy explorer. Yes, honey!

Amanda Testa: [Laughs]

0:14:17

UC Ossai: Yes. So much more fun, too. See, my pelvic floor relaxes when I say explore versus we have to be the expert. I’m tired. I work all damn day. I don't want to necessarily -- I tell people, “I’m not Captain Save You All.” I’m Captain Save UC, but I can't be always on all the time, and I think that’s the reality too. I’ve given this advice, and I think this advice is relevant depending on the person and where they are in life. Taking control of your sex life and telling your partner -- but sometimes people don't want to do that. Sometimes they're just like ah, I’m tired. Why do I have to tell them every little thing? I want them to read my mind. 

Amanda Testa: Yeah, it feels like work sometimes.

UC Ossai: Right?

Amanda Testa: You’re like I’m too tired. It’s too much.

UC Ossai: I’m too tired.

Amanda Testa: And it’s like I’ll just not worry about it.

UC Ossai: I’ll just not worry about it. I’ll just have sex, right? This is my point. this is why having that expanded view of sex can be real helpful. 

Amanda Testa: Mm-hmm.

0:15:14

UC Ossai: Because sometimes you're like I don't feel like telling you how to do that thing that I want you to do well but it’s not quite working for me, so let’s focus on sensual touch and massage for now, tonight, because that’s part of our repertoire. We’ll both be satisfied, and it’s gonna be beautiful, and then when I have the bandwidth I’ll talk you through the other thing that I feel like.

Amanda Testa: Yes, I love that. 

UC Ossai: Right?

Amanda Testa: Mm-hmm, and those other bonding behaviors or other sensual touch are other ways to be together. There are so many ways. You can define that for yourself too. It can look like anything, really, right?

UC Ossai: Literally anything.

Amanda Testa: Sex can look like anything.

UC Ossai: It can literally be anything. That’s the thing that I’m working with, with couples. If we just take you out of this binary concept of sex and just add onto it, it will just free you up so much. 

0:16:14

Sex becomes ten times more exciting when you have so many other ways to engage with your partner and value it. That’s the key thing. Valuing those other approaches are huge because if we minimize the value of those encounters and we don’t say -- my friends, when was the last time you had a passionate makeout sesh with your partner in the back of a car like you were a young whippersnapper in your teen years? That stuff is smokin’.

Amanda Testa: [Laughs] Yeah.

UC Ossai: Right?

Amanda Testa: Yes!

UC Ossai: Like, it will put blood in all of the parts of your body, especially if you kind of deal with a little time like ooh, we’ve got ten more minutes with the babysitter, let’s make out! You know? Whatever! I think that can be such a fulfilling moment, and then to hold that sensual space ‘cause you don't necessarily have to explore past that. You can just hold onto that sexual energy and let it build for a day, for an hour, for two days, for a week, and then express it in a way that your body desires in the moment. You see how I said it? I didn't say oh, then you can have penetrative sex. Express it in the way that your body desires, and being tuned into that enough, that’s what it really means to be a fully embodies sexual person.

0:17:47

Amanda Testa: Yes.

UC Ossai: It’s having that sexual flexibility. 

Amanda Testa: Mm, I love that term too. Sexual flexibility. It’s good, and how your body wants it. I think that is something too, just being in touch with what your body wants and needs. I think that brings me back to something that I want to touch back to. The painful part because when you are able to tune in, then you can feel and listen to that because it can be easy, also, to bypass what our body’s saying, bypass pain for whatever reason. When you can feel what your body needs and wants and you can talk about it, then you have so many more options.

I’m wondering, too, for anyone that’s listening that is struggling with painful sex or pelvic pain, what other advice you might have to give to them or maybe just some baby steps that they could start to explore.

0:18:45

UC Ossai: Sure, absolutely. So anytime people have unwanted pain with sex, know that there’s not one solution becuase pain with sex is an umbrella term. It’s like saying someone has bacne, right? 

Amanda Testa: [Laughs] Totally yeah.

UC Ossai: Hmm, it’s complicated meaning that there are lots of reasons, tons of reasons, why people have pain with sex. It could be that they're severely constipated. It could be that they have endometriosis. It could be that they have vulvodynia. It could be that they have clitoral pain that has nothing to do with vulvodynia. It could be that they have hip pain that’s referring into the levator ani or the pelvic floor. It could be because they have a prolapse that’s causing pelvic floor muscle hypertonicity. It could be because they have pelvic floor weakness and the muscles are strained, etcetera, etcetera, etcetera.

0:19:42

So my first piece of advice is to make sure that you're going to see a licensed medical professional who specializes in pelvic pain, who specializes in sexual pain. Usually, the people who are specialists are going to be a uro-gynecologist or a female urologist that specializes in female medicine. When I’m saying female medicine, that’s how usually they describe it, but women and non-binary vulva owners, that would be my first stop or gynecolosits who specialize in pelvic pain. They're out there. So identify those people first. It’s not just MDs. It can be PAs, nurse practitioners as well. So that’s gonna be the first step just to make sure that they screen and properly roll things out. But then from the non-medical side of things or from a less intensive let-me-make-an-appointment-with-the-doctor component, I think it’s first about understanding okay, what precisely hurts about sex. If it’s initial penetration, I always tell people that the solution to initial penetration isn't the same solution for people who have pain with deeper penetration.

Amanda Testa: Mm-hmm.

UC Ossai: One thing that we also have to remember is that there are a ton of nerves in our pelvic floor and those nerves come from the hip, the spine, the rectum, the bladder, all of that. 

0:20:58

So all of those can influence what’s happening. So if you're having pain with initial penetration, I would say the first thing is getting your partner to start slow, right? So starting with a finger. No matter who you're having sex with, starting with a finger, using a lot of lubricant. A lot of times people say use lubricant if you have pain with sex. Well, yes, if you actually have dryness, lubricant is very helpful, but if you don't, it’s actually just the idea of penetration. Having your partner kind of push -- and it’s hard to describe it here, but it’s almost like you're pushing your skin down towards your anus on your vulva, so it almost gives some slack to the vaginal opening. Then you insert the finger and just kind of massage at the opening, right? So if you think of your vagina as a clock, right (twelve is the urethra, six is the anus), then just massage from one to eleven, from right to left, just to kind of open things up, kind of desensitize the tissue a little bit. If that’s the only type of sex you're having where you're just having additional penetration, then you can practice doing side to side, then you can do in and out, whatever you decide. 

0:22:02

Also, using an external vibrator can be helpful, and not necessarily on the clitoris. For some people that’s perfect, right, because that helps to kind of distract and you can do penetrative intercourse with that, but also, you can put it on the pubic bone. When you put it on the pubic bone, it vibrates through the entire pelvic floor and can really act to help improve blood flow to the area and decrease pain sensitivity. So that can be really helpful. We call that pairing, but oftentimes usually people do pairing and they put it on the clitoris, but I like the pubic bone, ‘cause it really does help to relax muscle, and that can be great with initial penetration.

Now, for the folks who have pain with deeper penetration, again, a gang of issues. the first thing I always tell people, and people are shocked when I say this, make sure you're popping.

Amanda Testa: Yeah.

UC Ossai: Okay? I can't tell you how many times I did a pelvic exam and I go into someone’s vagina, and there’s, like, a mountain from their rectum because they haven't emptied, and they're like, “Yeah, that’s my pain,” and I’m like, “Oh, okay, ‘cause the penis, toy, finger keeps hitting the poop.”

0:23:09

Amanda Testa: Yeah.

UC Ossai: That’s straining that posterior vaginal wall, and that’s part of your issue, so make sure that you’re emptying your bowels well, that you're not overly straining. If you have a constipation problem, consult with a rectal specialist, but also work with a pelvic health physical therapist to help you with that. If you get that down, it that’s the cause, it can reduce your sexual pain by at least 50% or more. 

Amanda Testa: I just want to note to that too that I think it’s so interesting how constipation can affect your pleasure and also just how helpful it can be to go see a pelvic floor physical therapist because there’s so much that, like you say, little things we don't realize, just to the importance of pooping, right?

0:24:00

UC Ossai: I know! Who knew?

Amanda Testa: I know a lot of people that have this problem, so I just love that you named that. So thank you. [Laughs]

UC Ossai: Yes, plus, it always doesn't feel great when you're full of poop all the time. I mean, you're not gonna feel like a sexy superstar if you're carrying four days of stool, right? I don't feel sexy when I’m bloated. I don't know about you, right? I don't feel sexy when I’m constipated, and so, that’s just a fact. [Laughs]

Amanda Testa: [Laughs]

UC Ossai: You know?

Amanda Testa: Yes.

UC Ossai: It’s just a fact. It’s like we can have sex, but it’s not gonna be fun, you know?

Amanda Testa: Yeah, mm-hmm.

UC Ossai: Then another thing to consider with deeper penetrative pain with sex is the fact that sometimes those muscles are really, really strained or they might be too tight. and so, a couple of things off the market you can buy is Ohnut. It is a fantastic tool to help people with the components of penetrative sex. I tell people it’s a great tool to have in your toolbox whether or not you have pain.

Amanda Testa: Yeah.

UC Ossai: You can use it with your finger, you can use it with a strap on, you can use it with a penis. It’s fantastic, and it does limit the depth of penetration, right? Particularly for people who say it feels like something is hitting a wall in their vagina, that’s a great tool.

0:25:22

Another thing, too, is pelvic floor relaxation exercises, diaphragmatic breathing. Diaphragmatic breathing, especially when you couple it with your vagina and your pelvic floor is essential. Oftentimes, people just do the belly breathing. They don't really think about their pelvic floor. So I always tell people to make sure that you do a quick scan. Make sure your ears are relaxed, jaw is relaxed, shoulders out of your ears, relax your belly, pelvic floor, and toes. Relax your toes. If your toes are clenched, your pelvic floor is clenched. If your jaw is clenched, your pelvic floor is clenched. So make sure you do that quick scan, and then place your tongue to the roof of your mouth, breathe into your nose for three seconds, and when you breathe into your nose, you want your chest to stay still and that belly to expand. You want to feel the anus and vagina open as you inhale. It’s almost like you're inflating a balloon, and then as you exhale, you're deflating that balloon.

0:26:11

So you want to have that synergistic movement with your diaphragm and your pelvic floor to make sure that they expand and coordinate. What that does, not only yes, it does up-regulate your parasympathetic nervous system which is very important for sexual response and deregulates your sympathetic nervous system that’s thinking you're being chased by a bear all the time, but also, it helps with your blood flow to that area. It helps with pelvic floor muscle relaxation. It should be really, really nice particularly if you have pain with intercourse.

Those are my quick tips when it comes to different types of sexual pain. Then, also, we have to remember our folks who have pain with arousal before they're even touched and our folks who have pain after sex. The people who have pain after sex, it’s important to have an aftercare plan or afterplay is what I call it. We have foreplay; we need afterplay. Do you want to do couple belly breathing with your partner? Should you ask your partner to get you an ice pack or a heating pad? Do you want to get in child’s pose or happy baby pose to kind of help your body recover? Those are really nice things that you can do to take care of your body afterwards, particularly if you're a person where you're like I feel raw, I feel all these things.

0:27:19

Another thing, too, for those of you who have pain after sex. Private Packs is a fantastic tool. It’s a vulva pack that can be heated or cooled. It’s in CVS stores. Check out Suzanne Sinatra. She founded this company many moons ago, and she is just killing the game, and I recommend it to my patients all the time. 

Amanda Testa: Beautiful. I love that, and those are very doable things to remember and to hold in your toolbox. I think, too, I’d love to talk about if someone maybe has fear around going to see a pelvic floor PT or fear of bringing these things up with their medical provider ‘cause that is a big part of it, right? Oftentimes there’s a lot of shame.

UC Ossai: Yes.

0:28:09

Amanda Testa: Sometimes people feel uncomfortable talking or bringing it up. Of course, the medical care can run the spectrum.

UC Ossai: Absolutely.

Amanda Testa: Yeah, I’m curious how you can advocate for yourself if that’s true for you.

UC Ossai: So, first and foremost, that’s a great question. I want everyone to recognize that your sexual health is an indicator of your overall health. So people who have sexual dysfunction or sexual pain or they're not happy with their sex life, they have some sort of distress with their sex life, they're not gonna view themselves as healthy, okay? So it’s a very important indicator. I also want to acknowledge that we are all in this humanity thing together, and some of us in that humanity thing are also doctors and healthcare providers who also have our own hang-ups about sexytime and are not the best when it comes to bringing those up. Some of us are and some of us aren’t. 

Amanda Testa: Right.

UC Ossai: The Medical Programs across the board don't do the best job of preparing future healthcare providers for sexytime. That’s changing. It’s getting better, but historically, that has not been the case. So I just want to put that caveat. 

That being said, there are a ton out there who are really trying, who really want to empower you and support you.

Amanda Testa: Yes, yes.

0:29:25

UC Ossai: There are a ton of us out here. A ton. So the first thing is write down your questions. Write down your questions. I’m just using an example, if you're going to see your OBGYN, you maybe have 15 minutes, and so, you might have to make a separate appointment. Call ahead and say, “I have a concern about my sexual functioning. Should I make a separate appointment with doctor so-and-so to discuss that because I know I’m supposed to do my pap smear, and I’m supposed to talk about this other health issue. Yada, yada, yada,” right? And so, that’s the first advice I have.

The second advice I have is to understand that they may not have the answer to your solution, but they can at least give you referrals for that, right? So they can say, “Okay, thank you for sharing this with me. We definitely need to address this. Here’s what I can contribute to this. I can prescribe a medication. I can prescribe topical estrogen cream. I can prescribe Lidocaine cream. I could do this, but I do want you to address your fear with a licensed mental health professional or a coach or a counselor. I do want you to address your muscular and skeletal dysfunction with a pelvic health physical therapist. So I’m gonna make those referrals, and let’s circle back in three to six months and see how you're progressing,” right?

0:30:39

Amanda Testa: Yeah.

UC Ossai: If that doesn't happen, it’s not because you are inappropriate. It’s not because you asked a question that was not right. It’s simply because they do not have the answers and they may not feel comfortable telling you they don't have the answers or they may not be comfortable talking about sex even though they should because they're a healthcare provider. That’s not on you. So what I say in that moment is, “Okay, thank you! Do you have referrals? No? Okay, great, then I’ll find another provider that can help.”

Amanda Testa: Yeah.

UC Ossai: That’s how I would approach that because I think it’s really important for us to understand all the things that I just said, but then also be willing to walk away or seek someone that does match your energy, [Laughs] that does really want to help you in that capacity because it is a valid concern. So many times we see people with -- sorry, my alarm is going off. So sorry!

Amanda Testa: No worries!

0:31:43

UC Ossai: So many times, so many times we are seeing people living with chronic pain for five to ten years before they get help or living with sexual concerns for twenty years because they never brought it up or they brought it up one time and a doctor dismissed them and just said drink wine, you should be fine, and they drank wine, and they weren’t fine, and they were like well, I’m not gonna go back to that doctor. And so, I just want you all to think about it. This is a part of your health, and it is a priority, and you have a right to have your questions answered. You have a right to have full autonomy of your healthcare, and that means working with someone that’s going to take your concerns seriously and, at least, put you in a direction that will help address those concerns.

Amanda Testa: Yeah, and I’m wondering if you have any resources that you can share of where people can look if they're, maybe, wanting some supportive help, like, where they can go to find a great pelvic health PT or if there’s any resources or websites or anything you might recommend in that area.

0:32:52

UC Ossai: Yeah! Yeah, absolutely. So my favorite resource started by Jeanice Mitchell. She’s a pelvic health physical therapist. It’s called MyPFM.com for my pelvic floor muscles. She is a force to be reckoned with, and she created this nonprofit that’s all focused on pelvic health. She has a database where you can access, find providers in your zip code. She has a database within MyPFM.comhttps://www.mypfm.com, but then she also directs at Herman and Wallace which is another institute defying pelvic health specialists, and not just pelvic PTs, but massage therapists, nurse practitioners, doctors, all that. Then The Academy of Pelvic Health which is a branch of the American Physical Therapy Association. So that’s our governing body, and they really are the authority in our licensing and training, and they have a huge database as well, so you can find people on those websites for sure and simply enter your zip code.

0:33:53

And then, of course, you know, just like any provider, interview them. Call and say, “Hey, these are the concerns I have.” If they answer your questions appropriately then you're like, “Okay, great. I’ll make an appointment. See you in a few weeks.”

Amanda Testa: Yeah, I think it’s so important to advocate for your own healthcare, because I never realized the importance of this. [Laughs]

UC Ossai: Yeah.

Amanda Testa: Until I got together with my husband who is in medicine, and he just opened my eyes to so much about how you really have to advocate for yourself, and yes, you can trust people’s opinions, but also really listen to what your body’s telling you. If something is bothering you, and you can't get the answers you want, keep seeking, right? There are ways to find relief, and you don't have to live in pain. There are so many ways to find workarounds or find solutions. There's a lot of opportunity for healing. 

UC Ossai: Absolutely.

Amanda Testa: Mm-hmm.

UC Ossai: Absolutely. I cannot agree with that more.

Amanda Testa: And so, okay, now I want to just change the topic just a little bit.

UC Ossai: Yeah!

Amanda Testa: Because something, too, I love that you always talk about is kind of some popular myths about orgasm. 

0:35:06

UC Ossai: Oh, yeah, sure. Let’s do it.

Amanda Testa: Would you talk a little about that?

UC Ossai: Gosh, I mean, where do I begin?

Amanda Testa: Right? [Laughs]

UC Ossai: [Laughs] It’s fine! Choose your own adventure with that one!

Amanda Testa: This could be a multi-epic encyclopedias of information, but yes.

UC Ossai: I know. Okay, this is actually one of my favorite ones. That the orgasm achieved through the vagina or vaginal penetration is this mythical creature that if you don't achieve it, you're not a full person, and I just -- [Laughs] The reason I’m stumbling here is I don't get it. I don’t…

Amanda Testa: Yeah.

0:35:52

UC Ossai: So the thing about it is this. That pleasure is subjective, and we really have to think about this. I will tell you a story. I’ve been a pelvic PT for ten years, eleven years. I will never forget this individual that walked into my clinic one day, and they said to me, “I am anorgasmic.” I said, “Okay!” When we go through the interview, I said, “What about through clitorial stimulation? What is the sensation?” They're like, “Oh, I have orgasms with clitoral stimulation,” and I said, “Oh, okay.” That was my response. Oh, okay. In my head I was thinking they were anorgasmic. I’m like oh, okay, great. I said, “Okay, so then what is your concern?” And they're like, “Well, I’ve never had an orgasm vaginally. Clitorial orgasms, I have those easily. It’s not the same.” [Deep breath out] I said, “Well, why is it not the same?”

0:37:01

I think, honestly, what was happening was that through their upbringing, right, when they were not having orgasms with penile penetration, the kind of messaging from their partners was like oh, well there’s something wrong with you. That when I’m penetrating you, my penis isn't giving you an orgasm. And so, they thought that that was actually fact, and so did their partner. That’s an education deficit.

Amanda Testa: Right.

UC Ossai: That’s a true education deficit that this person has carried their entire adult life, and then when I finally kind of work it down for them and I said, “Listen, not all orgasms are going to be felt the same. You might have an intense orgasm one day. Later in the day, you might have an orasm that has a glass ceiling to it, right? There are many reasons that that happens.” And so, experiencing an orgasm isn't the goal of sex, but the method of how you expereince that orgasm also doenst matter as long as you're having pleasurable intercourse where you feel safe, where you feel sexual, where you feel good, right? If one day, you're having penetrative sex, and you’re massaging the clirotis and you're like whoa, that felt real different. That’s fantastic! Wonderful. You can repeat that in your next sexual encounter or, dare I say, don't repeat it and try a different path of pleasure and see where you go from there, see where that boat takes you.

0:38:42

When we talked through this after a few sessions, she actually felt a lot of anger about the years that she spent kind of shaming herself or blaming herself and pathologizing herself because of this very pervasive popular myth that this vaginal orgasm is the creme de le creme and all the other orgasms are trash. It’s just dripping in patriarchy. Ugh.

Amanda Testa: Yes. [Laughs] Ugh.

UC Ossai: Yeah, that myth is annoying. Then, the other myth that I also find annoying is the whole we need to cum at the same time. What? [Laughs]

Amanda Testa: Right? [Laughs] Yes.

UC Ossai: Really? No, I mean, if you're cloned maybe, you know? I think that -- [Laughs] sorry.

Amanda Testa: It’s true. 

UC Ossai: Romantic comedies have destroyed us, right, for this very reason. I think people do a lot of mirroring in sex too. When they're learning about sex they're mirroring their partner and they want to feel what their partner’s feeling and they want to engage, and yeah, depending on some tantric practices, some of those can happen. People can do a lot of things. 

0:40:03

You can kind of time all those things if you want to get deep and real into it, sure, but on the regular, simultaneous orgasms, that, again, should not be the goal. If you experience an orgasm at the same time as your partner, cool, but that doesn't mean you're doing anything right or wrong, it just means that that’s how the cookie crumbles.

Amanda Testa: Yeah.

UC Ossai: That’s great. Then the next time you have sex, if you cum first and your partner cums later, great. If they cum first and you cum later, great. We don't need to -- I think one of the things, too, is I tell people to free ourselves from these myths and really be self-centered when it comes to your sex life and really have that exploritative approach, because when you have that and you don't have that performative standard, it’s just so much more fun. 

Amanda Testa: Mm-hmm.

0:41:02

UC Ossai: It’s way, way, way more entertaining when you don't have in the back of your head, well, I need to make sure that I cum at the same time as my partner. 

Amanda Testa: That's just more stress, more lack of being in the minute probably.

UC Ossai: Yes!

Amanda Testa: That just is more of all the things and the breaks in your brain that are like meh. 

UC Ossai: Oh, yeah, it’s like you take a bath in Lidocaine; it just shuts everything down.

Amanda Testa: [Laughs] Yes.

UC Ossai: Like ugh. Your erotic mind cannot flourish when you're thinking about that.

Amanda Testa: Right. Thank you so much for all the amazing wisdom that you're sharing. I feel like I could just talk to you forever. I’m wondering, though, if there’s maybe any question that I didn't ask that you wish I would have asked or anything else that you want to make sure that you share?

UC Ossai: Gosh, no. I love this conversation. I love talking about rethinking how we approach sex, and knowing that it’s just going to continue to evolve. The way I think about sex now is not how I thought about sex five years ago. How I thought about sex five years ago is not how I thought about sex five years prior to that.

Amanda Testa: Yeah.

UC Ossai: I do not expect to think the same or necessarily have the same opinions in five years, but I definitely know that in five years’ time I’m gonna be more intimately connected to my body and my needs, and that’s the goal. We just want to evolve. We should all think of our sex lives in that way as we age and move through life.

0:42:46

Amanda Testa: Yes, and the evolving is possible for anyone. I can speak to that, I mean, at least for my experience and so many people and clients and stories that I hear, it’s possible, and so, just to have that, being able to feel the possibility of what’s available can really add hope. It’s like don't be dwelling on the circumstance you're in now, but there’s always a possibility for something different. Even when it feels hard there is, and so, that’s why there are amazing experts to help you. That’s one of the reasons, Dr. UC, I’m so happy that you came on because I really want to make it feel less hard to get what you want for yourself, right, to find the resources and tools that you need.

UC Ossai: Yes! One hundred percent. One hundred percent.

Amanda Testa: Yes, and thank you for all the amazing work that you are doing in the world and all the pleasure you're bringing to people. [Laughs]

UC Ossai: Thank you. I love it, and it’s just a joy, and I hope that people take away from this just a little tip, even if it’s a tip they may not take in personally but they can share with a friend because we all deserve to have a sex life that’s free of judgement, that’s empowered, and that we’re content and happy with.

0:44:00

Amanda Testa: Yes, and for everyone listening, too, I will let Dr. UC, in a second, share about all of her amazing ways to connect with her and get more information, but also, on her Instagram, it’s Y-O-U S-E-E L-O-G-I-C, @youseelogic, and she’s got such great content in there. She does her weekly Bourbon Tales where she’ll answer questions. And so, there’s just a plethora of information there, too, and resource that I want to make sure to send you to. Where else can people connect with you?

UC Ossai: Absolutely, so people can connect with me on my website www.youseelogic.com. I have a free platform there, Woke is the New Sexy where you have a free downloadable ebook that takes you through each of the subsections of intersectionality, penis owners, postpartum pregnancy, chain orgasms, you name it. We have it on there, and we’re updating all the content now, so you should be ready to go when you check it out. 

0:45:05

Then, if you want a little bit more guidance, I have my ebook, Reimagining Your Sex Life. It’s just a sexy swagger guide to how you can -- and this is geared towards women and non-binary folk -- but how do we reimagine our sex life? I do a segment called Swagger Tips on @youseelogic, and I took my top ten since I started and I just created this workbook that you could work through, and it’s been super fun to create that, and I’ve had a few people who bought the ebook and said, “Hey, I loved it, and I want some more help.” So they can book one-on-one sessions with me. Particularly, those of you who have pelvic health issues, as a pelvic health PT, I can talk you through that and counsel you through that and navigate those components, and so, I’m just really excited to share that with you all.

Amanda Testa: Yeah, and your website is such a goldmine of resources, so thank you. Yeah, and I will make sure, too, to put in the show notes all the details of where you can connect with Dr. UC. Thank you, again, so much for being here.

0:46:11

UC Ossai: Thank you Thank you, this has been great.

Amanda Testa: Thank you all for listening, and we will talk to you next week!

[Fun, Empowering Music]

Amanda Testa: Thank you so much for listening to the Find Your Feminine Fire podcast. This is your host, Amanda Testa, and if you have felt a calling while listening to this podcast to take this work to a deeper level, this is your golden invitation. I invite you to reach out. You can contact me at amandatesta.com/activate, and we can have a heart-to-heart to discuss more about how this work can transform your life. You can also join us on Facebook in the Find Your Feminine Fire group, and if you’ve enjoyed this podcast, please share with your friends. 

Go to iTunes and give me a five-star rating and a rating and a raving review so I can connect with other amazing listeners like yourself. 

Thank you so mUCh for being a part of the community.

[Fun, Empowering Music]